Conference Realignment
by newportVOL on Dec 16, 2009 8:54 PM EST
19 comments
All this talk about the Big 10 (11) expanding to 12 teams might have an affect on Tennessee.
From what I've read, two possible candidates are Nebraska and Missouri. If they jump (I don't know why anyone would leave the 2nd best conference for the 4th/5th best conference) (I guess there is the "tradition") then the Big XII would necessarily look for a candidate to replace. That likely candidate:
SEC whipping boy Arkansas-who might want to renew the old Texas school rivalries. That would leave the SEC looking for a new insitution (I still can't imagine the Hogs leaving the jugernaut payoff of the SEC, but who knows, they are Arkansas)
Leaving the SEC (and more importantly its huge monetary advanate) with its pick of who to join.
My vote would be for Georgia Tech. They're an old SEC school and I think has a genuine up and coming program. That triple option, I think, is exciting and fun to watch.
Just some speculation. What are your thoughts?
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Tiger High would probably like in, theyve wanted out of CUSA for awhile but
-they dont have the fanbase
-dont have the academics
-dont have the stadium
-and the football program doesnt have the money to fix any of the above
but I hear they have a pretty good basketball program…
RIP Steve McNair (1973 - 2009) Retire #9!
Hard-on for Hardesty!
by Pride of the Southland on Dec 17, 2009 12:09 PM EST reply actions
Just for convenience, I'd like to find a more westerly team to replace Arkansas within division as well.
But I really can’t think of one. Unfortunately, replacing Arky with a team in the East would probably move Vanderbilt to the West division. They and Ole Miss would then become the annual cross-division game for South Carolina and the new team.
That means that UT’s annual schedule would have:
Florida
Georgia
SoCar
Kentucky
new team (GaTech/FSU/Miami/Clemson/VaTech/etc.)
Alabama
That’s a brutal guaranteed roundup. Add in the tough noncon opponent that UT plays every year for recruiting purposes, and the other SEC West teams, and UT is basically praying for a Vandy/MSU slate.
What about Southern Miss? (I ask out of ignorance of their situation.)
I proposed this in the earlier thread
But if the new team isn’t VT, there may be more to moving UT than moving Vandy. It would solve the problem of unbalanced divisions (with Vandy and MSU together and no real bottom-feeders in the East). It will also allow Vandy to keep their rivalries with the East teams (except the East team that moves west). It’s been done before (Nashville is west of Auburn), presumably for these two reasons.
UT would lose Florida and probably Vandy, making Kentucky our yearly rivalry with an East team (I think UK is a bigger deal than Vandy, and I don’t see anyone who would disagree apart from Vandy fans). However, Florida has always been a non-traditional rivalry, and the move would allow us to regain traditional rivalries with Auburn and Ole Miss, the former of which has probably been as heated in the past as Florida is now. Also, as far as new rivalries go, UT/LSU would easily eclipse the current UT/Georgia rivalry (for the recruiting element of the game: New Orleans is the new Atlanta). We already have some bad blood between us from ’01 and ’07.
South Carolina could pick up the MSU permanent game vacated by Kentucky, and Alabama could pick up a yearly game with whichever other team joins the East (Alabama/Miami every year would be excellent).
Our yearly slate would then look like this:
Alabama
Auburn
LSU
Mississippi State
Ole Miss
Kentucky
Not bad, I say. I suppose, once we make an exception for Vandy’s geography, one could also make an argument for Georgia moving west (especially if VT is the new team added. UT/VT would be a big one. If Clemson or GT joins, Georgia obviously stays in the East). They could keep Florida as the yearly inter-division game (although Florida and LSU would go off the slate), but I don’t know who else they would lose (is UGA/USC a big deal? UGA/UK? UGA/Vandy?).
by Incipient_Senescence on Dec 17, 2009 2:23 PM EST up reply actions
I remember that discussion.
I just worry about getting taunts about not knowing East v. West. We already hold the whole eleven-in-the-Big-10 deal over them; why give them something in response?
We do submit ourselves to those taunts
But, as I mentioned, we’re already exposed to those taunts, or would be if the Big T[elev)en folks realized that Auburn is east of Nashville. And it’s still only one outlier (Vandy) that’s clearly put there to keep the competitive balance. I have no problem with this, if it comes down to it.
by Incipient_Senescence on Dec 17, 2009 11:11 PM EST up reply actions
Upon further thoughts
Vandy and MSU together in a division doesn’t unbalance things as much as I thought. I know that USC and Kentucky are good right now, but historically, do we have good reason to believe that USC and Kentucky will outperform Vandy and MSU? I’m not sure. Bama/LSU/Auburn is roughly equal to UT/Florida/Georgia. So the only remaining question is [new team] vs. Ole Miss. I’d say the new team is likely tougher, but it’s not that unbalanced.
by Incipient_Senescence on Dec 17, 2009 11:27 PM EST up reply actions
How about this one
Louisville.
I don’t think Arky would leave. The SEC has more money, and that pretty much ends the conversation, I would think. But if they did, Louisville might be a viable option. They already have the natural rivalry with Kentucky. Great basketball program. Football program that can be revived. Excellent fan support. And it doesn’t destroy geographical continuity (I am a huge proponent of geographic continuity in a conference. I think it should be a requirement. Conferences that lack geographic continuity shouldn’t even be called conferences. There should be another word for them. I’ll see if I can come up with an appropriate moniker for contrived ::cough ACC:: ::cough Big East:: amalgamations.).
I also like the original posters idea of Georgia Tech. They would have to play in the East, though, and Vandy would get moved.
...just apologize for not thanking me.
I'd compeltely forgotten about Louisville
They’d be perfect to slide into the West. There would only need to be one switch with the annual schedule, and it would be minor: rather than taking Arkansas’ rivalry with USC, they’d have one with UK. This would switch South Carolina and Miss. St. to each other, with USC losing Arky and MSU losing Kentucky.
by Incipient_Senescence on Dec 17, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions
Hmmm...Clemson?
I used to post on a message board with this guy who claimed to be a Clemson booster. He knew a lot of the history of the program, and knew, or at least knew the names of a lot of people in the Athletic department etc. Anyways, he used to always complain that the ACC gave Clemson the shaft and continues to do so. I don’t know the details, but it had a lot to do with Miami, BC, and VT coming on board. Anyways, he says that his feelings are mirrored within the administration and athletic department and basically said, over a year ago, that Clemson would be all too happy to leave if there was a better offer to be had. Ironically, this guy hated the SEC.
My personal choice would be USF. They are a new program who is already quite good and they play in a large stadium. I think it would also give Florida even more competition in recruiting once Leavitt started offering recruits the chance to play the best teams in the country every season.
My one fear with USF is their academic standard.
It’s lower than what you see elsewhere in the SEC, which could (further) harm the conference’s academic reputation and places them at risk of NCAA unhappiness.
I am from St. Petersburg
about 70% (not literaly) of my high school ended up going to USF. Most of them barely had a 3.0 gpa. So I can only imagine what their football standards are…
"Why does bottled water have an expiration date?"
How bout USF
they are in the South East, really really south east. They have established themselves latley as a contender.
"Why does bottled water have an expiration date?"
Lol.
The Big XII is not the 2nd best conference in America. Maybe 3 or 4.
by TennesseeQuackAttack8 on Dec 23, 2009 4:36 PM EST reply actions
Dead Issue
Arkansas won’t leave the SEC to go back to the Big12/SWC. Big 10 will probably add a team from the big east anyways…Pitt, Syracuse, or Iowa State (B12).
No matter how it breaks down, the Big East is going to eventually lose a team.
Under most scenarios (Missouri → B10, Arkansas → B12 (which I can see happening), whoever from the ACC, pick one → SEC), the Big East will eventually get pilfered. The only real way around that would be for someone to poach from the mid-major ranks before it even gets to the Big East, and while i like the idea of a Southern Miss or a Houston popping up to the BCS conferences, I can’t see that happening unless either the ACC or the Big East took a chance on them.
I can see something like Missouri → B10, Arkansas → B12, Clemson → SEC, USF → ACC, Central Michigan → Big East happening (and maybe that would put Vanderbilt in the SEC West …yikes, the East would be a mess). I can also see those first two steps, but Louisville popping over from the Big East too (with CMU still moving into the Big East). As much as I’d love to see Houston or Southern Miss up, I think their way to the BCS lies with the Mountain West taking them in and moving up as a group.
Simulated Gameday Experience - just like the real thing, only we have smoke machines.
Houston might go to the MWC, but I can't see Southern Miss getting invited.
The MWC has a chance to expand in a way that at least makes some geographic sense. While Houston and SMU (and, really, TCU) don’t fit the whole ‘Mountain’ part, and are fairly sketchy ‘West’ teams, the draw for Texas recruiting is too appealing to turn down. But a part of what doomed the WAC superconference experiment was that having teams from Hawaii, Louisiana, and the Rockies in one conference had such little connection for such long travels that there was no return on the investment. (In short, it sucked.) The MWC were the original WAC teams that got burned by the superconference, and they’re not going to allow that mistake to happen again.
Coming from the area, I could see Houston, but there’s no chance for Southern Miss. But your speculations on teams moving around do make sense. I personally don’t think Missouri will move, but I could be wrong.
I don't see why they would.
Then again, I know nothing of a Missouri-Iowa rivalry; I know the Illinois rivalry is real, but they play every year already; what’s the big deal about making it a conference game? Pitt has always made more sense to me than any of the other teams bandied about.
Of course, if the B10 were slick, they’d wait until Notre Dame’s TV contract got sliced, then they’d pursue expansion.
Simulated Gameday Experience - just like the real thing, only we have smoke machines.
I'm with you.
Missouri is in a good position with the Big 12. The B10’s biggest problem is that they don’t play after Thanksgiving, which takes them off the radar. They do that because the almighty Michigan/OSU game is that weekend, and they don’t want anybody playing after them. The cure is to move the rivalry game and let the conference add bye weeks. It’d give the B10 teams a rest week in the season as well as give them exposure and playing time later in the season, which is a total win-win.
They can cure the majority of their problems without expanding. It’s just stubbornness to worry about.
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