Do secondary violations matter . . . at all?
by Joel Hollingsworth on Jun 2, 2009 10:00 AM EDT
in College Football
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PrintMuch has been made of Tennessee's recent secondary violations. The toll, if I remember correctly, stands at something like four since Kiffin arrived. Eleven days ago, memphispete wondered if that was really out of the ordinary or whether Tennessee's were just getting more publicity.
Well, I haven't been able to find a list of the number of secondary violations for each SEC school as memphispete asked, but I did come across a post from MGoBlog that mentioned the total number of secondary violations for Ohio State since 2000. Rather than link to that post, I thought we'd put up a poll and let you guess how many that might be. No cheating! You can look up the answer after you post, and for those of you not so inclined, I'll try to remember to link to the answer later.
So . . . how many secondary violations as Ohio State reported since 2000?
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Very nice question
I went with the 100’s because, from what I have seen, most schools average about a dozen a year.
Interestingly, I wrote Chris Low a message on ESPN.com yesterday. It was very respectful, because I think he generally does very good work, but I questioned whether it was fair of him to write about UT’s secondary violations while failing to note how common they are among all programs. He hasn’t responded yet.
It is all about media hype, and the NCAA playing favorites
Coach K had a booster pay for Corey Maggette in 1999, no punishment.
Same thing with OSU/Michigan/Penn State. The media makes too much $$ off of them to actually hold them to the fire.
Conversely, you have people the media love to blow up (Currently Kiffin and Calipari) and thus, small things turn into “BREAKING NEWS” items.
No one can tell me Urban Meyer is 100% clean and forthcoming.
If peeing your pants is cool, consider me Miles Davis.
Joel, thanks for the follow-up.
Not many people would remember an idea posted by a reader and then roll with it later while also giving credit. Really cool of you …
No problem
Sorry we couldn’t find the true count of all SEC schools. I also thought of you while reading this from Dr. Saturday, so if you missed it, you might want to check it out. Lots o links in there. Conclusion? Secondary violations don’t matter.
Rocky Top Talk
by Joel Hollingsworth on Jun 2, 2009 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions
I’ve always believed that secondary violations are the NCAA’s way of encouraging schools to clear the air of things that are truly unintentional or may be difficult to interpret under their mountain of rules. That’s a much better route than letting those things fester and having schools learn to hide things (it always starts small…).
So I don’t think they matter in the sense of any direct consequence, but I really think they’re important for maintaining order in the whole process. Plus, it probably makes the coaches feel better if you let them think they ‘got away with something’ every once in a while.
by David Hooper on Jun 2, 2009 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Speaking violations, Coach Cal...
local radio station in Memphis reported today (6-2) that Joey Dorsey may also have had his test taken for him. Listening to interviews of the kid during his Memphis career
If true, that would represent a pattern of academic cheating under Coach Cal and explain why he felt so comfortable taking all those borderline kids at Memphis without many academic non-qualifiers. Rose, then Dorsey. IF true.
Antonio Anderson went to the same school as Dorsey. That was also mentioned. No link available, source is 560 AM The Sports Bar program on the drive home.
And,we still haven’t gotten to Worldwide Wes, plausible deniability, buffers, cut-outs and all the other stuff that was allegedly going on at Memphis.
As this firms up, and we should give it time, it should make for a “target rich” environment over at Sea of Blue.
(for the rare UK/UM lurkers, please note that major violations are worse than secondary infractions).
I think
that your advice to give this time is the best advice. At this point, the whole thing honestly could cut either way and it’s only fair to allow for all possible conclusions. Fandom is a subjective matter, but whether or not events happen (e.g. SAT cheating) are objective and don’t change based on our opinions.
Most importantly, we should allow the UK fans the opportunity to make up their own minds and give them a chance to dissent from Cal if these things happen to be true. One of the few things I utterly, utterly hate about fan-think is when fans of school X get boxed into a corner because rival fans extrapolate too much about the fans as a result of one coach. (Hope that made sense.)
It does, hooper
It is more than a little frustrating to live in a city where the Blue Kool-Aid was not only sipped but chugged – resulting in undeserved sainthood for Coach Cal. They ignored nine years of intensifying stories that circulated him. They ignored the uneasiness associated with some of the players he recruited because he got great players who overcame his average X-O’s coaching ability to win a lot of games.
After living through most of that run with Blue Kool-Aid infused fans, it is enjoyable to hear my arguments recycled back to me. They have turned on him as Coach Cal has revealed his character to them by abandoning them for the other Big Blue, taking all their recruits (partly by revealing the violations BEFORE they hit the press), and leaving them with his mess to clean up.
I hope the KY fans stop drinking their own Blue Kool-Aid and realize what they have picked up. It isn’t good for the conference if one of the better programs in hoops history experiences probation. It isn’t likely that they will turn on him early, but we can hope for their sake (and for ours as members of the SEC) that they do so.
I’d actually like to have Kentucky return as a national power – as long as they lose at least two conference and two tournament games a year – to BP.
We saw this year just how much the SEC is hurt by a down Kentucky.
Love ‘em or hate ’em, they’re good for the conference when they’re good. And as long as UK fans are willing to be honest about their coach, I’m willing to give them enough room and respect for their opinion.
And watching them enter the tourney every year with a x-4 record would be a lot of fun.
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